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mr-355-5sfte01-30-2006, 11:21 PMHello everyone.... only my second post here on the forum, so I'm still searching for info.

I've been looking into this swap for a while now, I first replaced my 5sfe with a 5sfte that I had personally built... and destroyed... then decided to go with a 3sfe to get me around from school and work....
I've since replaced the engine in my subaru and now have the ability to finally "finish" my mr2. I was wondering which of the various toyota V-6 engines is the most popular swap... and by popular I mean, has been completed numerous times... many write-ups... harness diagrams...install photos..... fabrication of motor mounts (if any)...
I would love to find a 5vzfe for under $2.5k... but that's probobly not going to happen... I've since focused on the 3vzfe's and possibly the 1mzfe. has anyone here had any experience in a swap including these two engine designs?
any help on this would be greatly appreciated.
Thanks in advance
David mr-355-5sfte01-30-2006, 11:31 PMMods... disreguard this thread... actually just delete it! I scrolled down on the main board... and realized my questions have been answered numerous times!! my use of the "search" option didn't produce much... but I found what I was looking for.
thanks canadam01-31-2006, 12:26 AMhaha, no worries man.

Welcome to the board. Our V6 section rocks :) mr-355-5sfte02-05-2006, 08:50 PMI've found a 5vzfe on ebay with 79k miles that's listed as a 3vzfe.... it's only up to $510, and is about three hours away from me... the guy says he'll throw in the ecu and harness for free... so I'm hoping to bid on that mother up to $1.5k ... if it should go past that, I'm not going to be dissapointed.. there are dozens of 1mzfe's and 3vzfe's on there that are not even half that price.
unfortunately there are NO donor cars around middle TN (nashville) that I can snag... well, no manual cars. so I'm going to stick with my Jap tranny that I purchased for my 3sfe... it's an auto A241E, but it does have a full locking diff in it.... so just to clarify my options here:

my auto tranny and axles will work with any of these three v6's : 1mzfe, 3vzfe, 5vzfe... the tranny will bolt to the block (almost completely depending on the engine) and my axles will need no modification.

as for the wiring issues, will I need a dash panel with complete gauges from the v6 donor? or could I simply tap into the stock tac harness.. with it being a bit off and all...
I know I'll dispose of the 3sfe ecu, and most of it's components.... I will not have AC, cruise, or any form of forced induction... for now. so should I simply wire the v6 in the bay with it's harness and ecu, then splice my dash harness (gauge cluster: tacometer, voltage, warning lights) into the corresponding wires for the v6?? this is where I start wondering about my options.
I know I can get the engine installed and braced properly, but electronics have never been my specialty... after reading the post "why 3vzfe's are better" I feel I shouldn't get a vvt-i engine... but rather a jdm 3vzfe with no EGR system and use a USDM harness... since the ecu doesn't seem to mind that the egr is not working... at least that's what I got from the thread. that and the vvt-i's seem to throw trouble codes left and right.
so for now I'm staying with the 5vzfe unless I'm outbid... which I am expecting. so I will keep looking for a 3vzfe also.... could someone specify which models the 3vzfe's came out of?

thanks guys... sorry for the rambling! Toysrme02-06-2006, 12:10 AM92-93 Camry / ES 300 (North America)
92-97.5 Camry (Any sold as 3.0L) / Windom (Japan / asia)
92-96 Camry (Australia) Oteck02-06-2006, 01:00 AMwell you DON"T need to mess around w/ the dash harness, the cluster lights like the oil/water connects to the rear fusebox. You'll still need the tach adapter since the signals need to be addressed. Mitch sells them...
I havent seen the plugs they used on the 5vz but having the dash harness helps out when ever you need some plugs/connectors. You'll still have to figure out your own wiring, it's not easy so get the wiring diagram and lots of time Oteck02-06-2006, 01:01 AMalso if your going to stick to N/A the mz are a better platform canadam02-06-2006, 01:11 AMSupport ?


also if your going to stick to N/A the mz are a better platform Weasy2k02-06-2006, 02:05 AMSupport ?

hes correct....stock for stock that is....

Just because the mz series is a newer deisgn and have a better stock power output.

I wouldnt go as far as saying N/A PERIOD is better for MZ...cause im sure my 5vz will be having fun N/A at 7500rpm...

'

Will see oteck...5vz vs 3mz once were both done :devil: canadam02-06-2006, 03:14 AMGR Platform is the fastesttttttttttttttt Weasy2k02-06-2006, 11:21 AMGR Platform is the fastesttttttttttttttt


And it would be :P So.....Adam...


Buy your MKII.....


and roll a I350....

vy ola canadam02-06-2006, 02:15 PMI tihnk there's a better chance that a Rav4 will come up for salvage in my area loooooong before an IS350 ever will Weasy2k02-06-2006, 08:22 PMwhy do you think i said go and roll a I350...comon mr2greasemonkey02-06-2006, 10:52 PMgo buy a fiero, do the northstar swap. call it good, heh. mr-355-5sfte02-06-2006, 11:39 PMso.... I should stick with the 3vzfe!? and disreguard that 5vzfe in Ga. ok.... so will I need the tach adaptor for the 3vzfe, or just the 5vzfe ... and what models did the 3mzfe come in... so I can find a complete harness. all the engines I've found on the internet don't have complete harnesses... or an ecu.... Weasy2k02-07-2006, 12:42 PMwww.v6mr2.com

all those engines are good
I like to sum it up like this
STOCK internals:
VZ series = good for boost with little to no internal mods
MZ series = a lot better to run N/A but not as good with boost

Now you choose :) mr-355-5sfte02-07-2006, 06:41 PMseems easy enough! thanks for the direct info! but believe me, I'll have many more questions soon. Weasy2k02-07-2006, 11:27 PMyea lots of work regardless of the path....mounting the engine is what everyone worries about....well theres more to it then just mounting the engine :) mr-355-5sfte02-08-2006, 09:31 PMactually I'm not worried about the mounting issues.... just the wiring. making things with my hands is no problem... but I seem to have trouble with electrical components. I'm reading everything I can, but I was kind of hoping to find a "step by step" page explaining exactly what to do with the harness.... but hey, you guys have helped tremendously... and all the fsm harness diagrams are going to help with the identification of the wires... so I've got a feeling I'm going to have to do some grafting.... to what? I'm not that sure yet!! but I AM doing this build!!
thanks again guys Oteck02-09-2006, 12:09 AMmy tip is look at mikes 1mz to 3sgte diagram. it would give you a nice chart to follow where to hook up the lines. most are pretty basic +b goes to +b and so on till you get to the black box Weasy2k02-09-2006, 03:04 AMmy tip is look at mikes 1mz to 3sgte diagram. it would give you a nice chart to follow where to hook up the lines. most are pretty basic +b goes to +b and so on till you get to the black box
yea and the flight data recorder is also tough to wire in too Toysrme02-09-2006, 02:39 PMYa.
Download the corisponding Lexus ES FSM's that were previously provided also. Remember that the ES 300 got the vvt-i 1mz-fe in 1999, while the rest of the camry platform got it later so. mr-355-5sfte02-23-2006, 03:55 PMI've been searching for a tranny to fit my 3vzfe since I've been informed that my a241e will probobly melt after a bit of abuse. I was looking on ebay a few minutes ago and noticed the JDM Camry trannies have the shift lever and hoses on the same side as my mr2 auto tranny.. so I was wondering if I could simply use the camry tranny without having to relocate the shift cable housing.... .... basically, would simply accept my shift cable?
now the axles are a different story... will the camry axles accept my mr2 wheel hub\spindle ...or will my mr2 axles work with the camry tranny???
has anyone ever looked into this, or are all the v6 swaps into manual cars? personally, I'd prefer a manual.... but I can't find the parts to the swap... and a manual parts car (non existant in my state) is impossible to find....
thanks for your input
Dave Weasy2k02-24-2006, 01:04 AMare u sure about that? how are they on the same side? mr-355-5sfte02-26-2006, 10:52 AMyeah, that's all I've heard too... "that the shift cable housing would have to be swapped" but from the pictures I was shown: the tranny and engine were sitting together just as if they were bolted up.... and the automatic transmission's gear selection fork was on the front.... with the cable attatched.
I'll have to see if I can get those pictures... seems too good to be true! mr-355-5sfte02-26-2006, 10:59 AMhttp://i21.ebayimg.com/04/i/04/4b/37/1a_1_b.JPG

the only thing that looks different on this tranny than my a241e is the starter location... it looks a bit higher up on the housing.

but the shift fork is clearly up front on this 3vzfe auto tranny... so maybe this is something to add to the v6 swaps list...." no mod of auto tranny required" that is, for the FEW that would go that route.

I'm going to look into the axles next. Weasy2k02-26-2006, 12:29 PMyea looks like it works out mr-355-5sfte03-12-2006, 05:27 AMhas anyone had any problems with the exhaust manifolds contacting either firewall on a 3vz swap? I forgot where I heard this, but I figured I should ask. V6'er03-12-2006, 09:40 PMDavid,

No matter what engine you use, your 4-cylinder tach needs some sort of an adapter to work on a 6-cylinder engine.

OR, I can convert and calilbrate your tach to a V6 unit.

Mitch mr-355-5sfte03-13-2006, 12:14 PMMitch,

thanks for the information on the tach prob... as for that adaptor you're talking about, I wouldn't want to take any business away from you... so I'm not going to ask how you would convert them... but I would rather try the work myself if I could aquire the parts needed... do you sell a conversion kit??? and if all else fails, what would that conversion cost for you to make the adaption?
I was told (can't remember by whome) to graft the harness to my tach's plug... and that's that.... but I had a feeling that was too good to be true. but given it's going to be an auto-daily driver... if the tach is off .. it's off.. I mean If I had to, I could put in an aftermarket... but I'd rather not.

if you can spare some info that won't take money out of your pocket... I'd apreciate it.

Dave mr-355-5sfte03-13-2006, 12:15 PMso anyone had any problems with the "firewall smack" ? Weasy2k03-13-2006, 01:11 PMthere is no problem with that from what i recall DaveMush03-13-2006, 03:31 PMDavid,

No matter what engine you use, your 4-cylinder tach needs some sort of an adapter to work on a 6-cylinder engine.

OR, I can convert and calilbrate your tach to a V6 unit.

Mitch


He did that to mine, ages ago. Works fine for any car that is not using an A/C system. Infact, I'm using it again in my new swap. DaveMush03-13-2006, 03:34 PMMike King had discovered that with the 10 or so year old engine/torque mounts used with the V6 engine (and the greater amount of torque that engine has)... That the heads would come damn close to the rear/trunk firewall.

Solution offered was to fill the mounts, or use TRD mounts to control the engine torque/movement. mr-355-5sfte03-13-2006, 03:35 PMhow much did that setup cost you? ^ (the tach)

and thanks for the firewall\old motor mount info! DaveMush03-13-2006, 03:57 PMCouldnt tell yah, I dont remember really.... Almost 2 years ago now mr-355-5sfte03-13-2006, 04:10 PMhere's a few more of my concerns that I have not yet found pre-determined
solutions to (if these are even classifiable as problems)

on the 3vzfe swaps... what has everyone done about the MAF? I've seen it left on certain swaps... but on others, it's gone. or could it be that the engines without the maf are the 1mzfe's... and I just couldn't tell the difference??

also, has anyone had a problem with the throttle cable fitting?

what about the brake booster systems? will the changed vacuum from the v-6s affect the braking system?

and is an aftermarket FPR REQUIRED when using a walbro (or similar) lph fuel pump? I would think that the excess fuel would be routed back to the tank, as performed by the stock system....?? (I'm not looking for crazy hp) stock is perfectly acceptable to me.

and the cooling system... will reversing the flow of the stock mr2's system have a negative effect on it's ability to cool the engine? I've been given a tip to simply move the water temp sensor.. or reverse the flow. clearly the easiest route would be to reposition the sensor....

and I'm sure I've got more to come.. so thanks in advance V6'er03-13-2006, 08:59 PMon the 3vzfe swaps... what has everyone done about the MAF? I've seen it left on certain swaps... but on others, it's gone. or could it be that the engines without the maf are the 1mzfe's... and I just couldn't tell the difference??

also, has anyone had a problem with the throttle cable fitting?

what about the brake booster systems? will the changed vacuum from the v-6s affect the braking system?

and is an aftermarket FPR REQUIRED when using a walbro (or similar) lph fuel pump? I would think that the excess fuel would be routed back to the tank, as performed by the stock system....?? (I'm not looking for crazy hp) stock is perfectly acceptable to me.

and the cooling system... will reversing the flow of the stock mr2's system have a negative effect on it's ability to cool the engine? I've been given a tip to simply move the water temp sensor.. or reverse the flow. clearly the easiest route would be to reposition the sensor....


Ok, let's go:

1. A 1MZFE has an MAF.

2. Throttle cable fits fine, but if you convert an N/A car without cruise (like mine), it comes up too long. The fix is to make a bracket to move the cable mount away from the TB. Let me know if you need that, I have a CAD drawing of it.

3. Brakes are fine.

4. You need a return-style FPR, or, you mod your in-tank pump assembly to have a Camry FPR.

5. Reversing the coolant flow with a 1MZ makes the piping SO much easier, but it does screw up the fan control. (Don't believe anybody that says their fans don't run too much- they just can't hear them.) I don't know if you have reversed flow with a 3VZ. You do not with a 5VZ.

Don't sweat the coolant reversal. I make that part too. (A replacement temp sensor.) :D

Regarding the tach conversion, it takes a signal generator, a frequency counter, an oscilloscope, a stash of resistors, a knowledge of electronics, and a lot of patience. mr-355-5sfte03-13-2006, 10:18 PMMitch,

great info... I'm up to speed with the MAF.. or lack there of, the brake vacuum, and the throttle cable (mine is...or was, cruise equipped).. as for the fuel and tach issue....

the stock N\A fuel pump will not supply enough fuel for the 3vzfe.. correct? hence the walbro upgrade..... I was under the impression that the 3vzfe was equipped with a fuel return system, as was the douce... I will get some diagrams of both fuel systems at school on tuesday... and hopefully figure something out. If I don't, I know where to come!

so reversing the coolant flow (without moving the temp sensor) will only make the cooling fans run more than usual....

and as for your tach mod.... I applaud your ability... I was never the best electrician in the group of car guys!
so what would that tach modification set me back... dinero wise...?

if I could aquire a tach or entire cluster from a 93 camry with the 6cyl.... would I have any issues going that route? Node03-14-2006, 01:22 AMThe stock NA fuel pump can actually handle 200ish if thats what you are after. I would reccomend an upgrade though.

As for the coolent flow, since you have to fabricate the coolent lines anyway why not make some hoses up that hook up the right way? No offence intended but it just seems a lot simpler. mr-355-5sfte03-14-2006, 02:59 PMI've found a complete gauge cluster for $30.. with the harness conectors.... maybe I should just go that route??? mr-355-5sfte03-14-2006, 03:08 PMnode,

my NA pump is 215k miles old... and is making some racket. is the 3vzfe even equipped with a fuel return line? or is it simply an evap hose?
any idea on using the v6's gauge cluster? Toysrme03-14-2006, 05:34 PMThe 3vz's do use a return fuel rail/line, and FPR. The FPR is fine with high-flow pumps. Several of us are running the stock FPR + ebay FPR + Walbro 190/255's. (IDK about mr2 fuel systems, but based off experiances with Camrys... DO NOT use a high-pressure walbro pump. It's just begging to split an old fuel line. Just remember that it rises with boost at a 1:1 ratio until it hits the housing.
The 3vz-fe's do have an EVAP hook-up, however it doesn't monitor, nor use it. EVAP falls the same as the EGR & Cat convertor on a 3vz-fe. It's there, but since it is not monitored by the ECU - so there are no problems with ditching it. (*note* California, and New York delivered 3vz-fes ARE known to have a post-cat o2 sensor.)

You can swap the AFM off of a 3vz-fe. Understand noone has yet had reason to. It is the large size Denso AFM (Generation II). It has *less* pressure drop less than the average MAF. The large Denso housing is rated at one in/hg of pressure drop at 200CFM. A 3vz-fe should be taking in a peak of right about 235CFM-255CFM. (Depending on if it's bone stock, or light mods to turn it more into the 200/205 later, less de-tuned version. i.e. AFM & distributor tweaks.)
(Also. Denso AFM's turn the fuel pump relay on. Which just makes it too much trouble for us car guys to ditch. Not something any of you will ever deal with, but, ya know.)

I can't say that anyone has actually done a MAF swap. I've not known of a single "ditch the AFM" project. The pressure loss is so low, it really isn't going to help tons by ditching it. It's seriously into diminishing returns by changing it.

The average 2 3/4-3" MAF is going to have a pressure drop around 7-10in/hg on the engine running (at whatever it injests). If it has screens you can bust out, count on it coming out more around 5-7in/hg. Compaired to the 2 3/4-3" Denso MAF that's going to work out around 2-5 in/hg.





And remember... If you're going to stick with the stock ECU, you can always play with the Idle-bypass screw, Arm angle & the spring tension on the cog to get some mild tweaking done!
Fun! mr-355-5sfte03-14-2006, 08:56 PMThe 3vz-fe's do have an EVAP hook-up, however it doesn't monitor, nor use it. EVAP falls the same as the EGR & Cat convertor on a 3vz-fe. It's there, but since it is not monitored by the ECU - so there are no problems with ditching it.
^ I had read this in a "v6 build" thread once before... but I still got a good kick out of seeing it again!!


so the stock mr2 fuel pump should push enough fuel to the 3vz? I need a new one anyway, so I guess I'll source a factory replacement. and some lines!

as for my situation on the AFM, I was just wanting to know if the 3vzfe ('93 model) was actually equipped with one... as mine is aparently MIA. I had no intent of ditching it if it was actually a factory component on the 3vz... I'm heading for a stock 3vzfe in the 'ol douce... decent mileage, more power, much better sound... and most of all Toyota reliability. Weasy2k03-14-2006, 09:21 PMwhy factory replacment? when a walbro costs less? mr-355-5sfte03-14-2006, 09:33 PMwhy the factory replacement?

toysrme had said
DO NOT use a high-pressure walbro pump. It's just begging to split an old fuel line

and I had been leaning towards the 255lph walbro until he brought that information to my attention.... I've found another walbro rated at 190lph for a few bucks less... If I were to replace my fuel lines with braided SS, there should be no problem in running the 255lph pump correct? I mean, should I decide to add some forced induction later on... V6'er03-15-2006, 10:29 PMYou could use a V6 tach from a Camry or whatever. Most of the tach motors will swap out. Toyota did mount some of them upside down, so you'll have to remove the needle and calibrate the tach when you are done.

If you do a 1MZ, it's SO MUCH better and cleaner to have the lines crossed (MR2 crossed, not crossed for the 1MZ) and relocate the temp sensor. Toysrme03-16-2006, 04:32 AMDon't go too far with what I say... Remember
Both myself & McElligott use Walbro 255's on our stock fuel lines without problem. Him for years, me for about a year, minus down time this winter for various crap of all kind.
Low pressre, no problem. high pressure, ask your mr2 folks if running a 255 high pressure on stock fuel lines causes a problem. V6'er03-16-2006, 07:56 AMStock Turbo pump (brand new) installed almost two years ago, 51 PSI for 20k miles so far.

Methinks it's fine. :) DaveMush03-16-2006, 02:11 PMAsk your mr2 folks if running a 255 high pressure on stock fuel lines causes a problem.

I used a 255Lph HP pump on my first v6 swap, I'll be using it again too. I also used stainless braided 6an fuel lines. The rest of the lines from the mr2 tank are all metal.

I did fine.
Mitch has been fine with the Mr2T pump.
Randy has been fine with the Camry V6 pump.
Adrien I think used the Camry pump too. Weasy2k03-16-2006, 03:16 PMthe stock lines can handle a lot...
I put 350psi through them :) They can do it :P mr-355-5sfte03-16-2006, 10:59 PMI guess I should specify that I've gone with the 3vzfe... mr-355-5sfte03-17-2006, 10:21 PMwait... I was removing unnecessary parts on the engine today and noticed that the engine block is stamped 4vzfe ..?? is this engine code simply the japanese version of the 3vzfe? kind of like my 5sfe 2.2 was directly replaced with the jap. 3sfe 2.0 ?? V6'er03-17-2006, 11:44 PMMy websearch says that a 4VZFE is a 2.5 liter engine. I'd be investigating that engine VERY carefully.

Is that a J-spec motor? A 4VZFE was used in the Windom in Japan. mr-355-5sfte03-17-2006, 11:51 PMhttp://myspace-495.vo.llnwd.net/00576/59/46/576256495_l.jpg
here's the v6 next to my 3sfe mr-355-5sfte03-17-2006, 11:57 PMI just ran a search also... everything I've found says the 4vzfe was the newer 2.5L used to replaced the older 2.5's in camrys and such.... time for a little talk with the guy who sold this engine as a 3vzfe. flyingbrick03-18-2006, 08:45 AMbadluck mr-355-5sfte03-18-2006, 12:21 PMCheck out what this guy is saying.... he is under the imression that the head and block are the same.. it's the intake and exhaust that make it a 2.5!!!


It's the same as 3vz engine. 4vz is Japan version but it will work same as 3vz. The cylinder head and block are exact the same. The differents is, 2.5L intake, 2.5L exhaust manifold, 2.5L fuel injection, 2.5L wiring and 2.5L ecu. Okay! David. If I place an ad with 4vz and I'll bet you know one know about 4vz. Because I have place an ad for 4vz on ebay before and most of American don't know what is 4vz. So, I'll told them is the same as 3vz cylinder head and block. Only me, myself and I know. Because I've sold alot of these particular engine in US, and they have no problems stating up or any hasselness and it work just fine like an 3vz engine, again you have to transfer every components from your old engine to the 2nd engine.

souds like a scam to me.. "I'll sell you a 2.5L as a 3.0 only because I know the difference"

I've already filed through paypal for a refund... but that's not likely to occur.

anyone have ANY experience with these 2.5's ?? I mean sure... it LOOKS the same as the 3vzfe, hell I didn't know it wasn't until I was tearing it down. any power specs on the little 2.5L ?? Weasy2k03-18-2006, 12:37 PMThe 4vz-fe is a different engine...
The 4VZ-FE is a 2.5 L engine, designed to replace the 2vz-fe as Toyota's worldwide 2.5L v6.
Windoms used the 3vz-fe, sceptors used the 4vz-fe. That changed to the 1mz-fe, and 2mz-fe.

Stolen from Toysrme mr-355-5sfte03-18-2006, 12:41 PMENGINE- TYPE- YEAR -BORE- STROKE -CC -COMP - PS -RPM

3VZFE - V6 - 92-96 -87.5 - 82.0 -2958 -9.6 -200 -5800

4VZFE -V6 - 92-96 -87.5 - 69.2 - 2496 - 9.6 -175 -6000


YEAH COMPLETELY DIFFERENT! mikeswickednick03-18-2006, 01:55 PMdid u order that engine from patterson nj, are u from lebanon nj? Weasy2k03-18-2006, 01:59 PMYep

Its a SHORT SHORT stroke motor...man that thing would be SO AWSOME to build up Node03-18-2006, 03:46 PMWow, that is impressive. I wonder if the crank can handle 11,000 RPM mikeswickednick03-18-2006, 04:46 PMso short stroke is better for reving? too bad that thing doesnt have vvtl-i Toysrme03-18-2006, 06:16 PMLoL! mikeswickednick reminded me that we had a discussion about that very engine seller & engine being a 4vz-fe some time back.
You got screwed.
That thing needs to be returned at his expencive, along with your money refunded.

It is not the same block, they are not the same heads, the electronic components are only cousins as they're both Denso/Toyota parts.

Get ebay to kill his accounts.
Hopefully you paid via a US Money Order. Because the Postal Service is involed, it defaults as mail fruad. While it takes the postal service quite a little while to get to it (They're busy). Mail fraud is a FEDERAL crime. It is not some dinky little thing... canadam03-18-2006, 06:17 PMYOU CAN SAY THAT AGAIN mikeswickednick03-18-2006, 06:24 PMholy tripple post batman Weasy2k03-18-2006, 06:27 PM:P Fixed Yes the shorter stroke is good for revving :) V6'er03-18-2006, 06:54 PMVery carefully document ALL transactions with this idiot and send it all off to PayPal. You are very likely to get your money back. Mr. Idiot can pay to ship his own motor back to himself.

Do NOT keep it, no matter what. mikeswickednick03-18-2006, 07:07 PMhell if ur from lebanon nj, patterson isnt that far away. u could go to his shop Weasy2k03-18-2006, 07:20 PMyea i would fix the situation....Its an engine i would like to get my hand son in the future but for your sake...get a real 3v mr-355-5sfte03-19-2006, 09:38 AMI am from Lebanon, Tennessee..... I'm going to send paypal the latest replys he's sent here in a minute. The Guy's name is "Kenneth Tran" and his ebay acount ID is "ktauto2u" ... avoid this guy for 3vzfe's.... but if you want a 4vzfe, just buy his 3vzfe!!

incase they (paypal) rule in his favor... do you think my 3vzfe ECM and harness will be accepted by the 2.5 ? the 2.5 is supposed to have a higher rev than the 3.0 , but the ecm will cap that at the 3.0's range correct? mr-355-5sfte03-19-2006, 11:52 AMthis is what paypal has to say about the situation:



You are responsible for shipping and handling costs associated with returning the item. Once you ship the item, please provide us with an online tracking number by Mar. 28, 2006. This tracking number allows us to confirm that you shipped the item. Please understand that if you fail to provide this information, your case will automatically be closed.

We recommend that you ship the item using a service that can supply proof of shipment or a tracking number. Otherwise, you may need to rely on the seller to confirm if the item was received.

I'm thinking of taking some pictures of a 3VZFE... and shipping them back to him with a note saying,
" it's the same engine... same block... same head, just the PHYSICAL part is different "
and supply paypal with the tracking info so they'll immediately refund my money... once the shoebox arrives with his engine, he can file a complaint... and I'll tell him to go die. Weasy2k03-19-2006, 12:59 PMI like the way you think! Oteck03-19-2006, 05:27 PMi'd like to get my hands on 2mz crank... Weasy2k03-19-2006, 05:51 PMhehe reading my mind mr-355-5sfte03-20-2006, 12:12 PMI've decided to go with the "shoebox" move...
I'm going to try this engine and see if it's worth swapping.... I've yet to find power specs on this little mother, but it will SUPPOSEDLY work with the components I have already sourced.... says mr. tran.. but he also said they were the same engine..so....
hell, it's only .3 liters greater displacement than my stock 2.2 ... probobly not even worth my time.... Weasy2k03-20-2006, 02:14 PMgo with some concrete
send him the engine back and look for the real thing mr-355-5sfte03-20-2006, 03:29 PMgo with some concrete
send him the engine back and look for the real thing

so are you saying.... send a shoebox full of concrete? cause that's what will probobly happen.
if I send him the engine back... I'm out $600 shipping.. and have no engine.. then I get to start looking all over again...
the way i see it, he screwed me... knowingly... now it's my turn. Toysrme03-20-2006, 03:40 PMI've yet to find power specs on this little mother, but it will SUPPOSEDLY work with the components I have already sourced....

You'll have to get an FSM for it & those are not avalible to us in the US.


171bhp @ 6000rpm
165lb-ft @ 4800rpm
2496cc
9.6:1 CR
87.5mm bore (Typical VZ)
69.2mm stroke mr-355-5sfte03-20-2006, 04:14 PMYou'll have to get an FSM for it & those are not avalible to us in the US.

awesome!! I guess I'm gonna have to wing it. I hope I never go to california..... I'd be all over the news. Weasy2k03-20-2006, 04:15 PM87.5mm bore (Typical VZ)


94.5mm 5vz :) V6'er03-20-2006, 08:26 PMSue him in Small Claims Court. If he doesn't show up for court (which you of course need to do in NJ), he will forfeit his case to you. You can sue for return shipping if he's supposed to get the motor back. mr-355-5sfte03-20-2006, 09:16 PMwhy NJ? because it's on the opposite coast from him? V6'er03-20-2006, 09:37 PMOK, California. Sorry, I read that wrong. mr-355-5sfte03-20-2006, 09:47 PMfound somemore random crap on the 4vzfe equipped windom...

Displacement, cc----- 2496
Engine model -----4VZ-FE
Max.power (Net), -----kw(PS)/rpm 175 ps (128.71 kw) / 6000 rpm
Max.torque(Net), -----N*m(kg*m)/rpm 22.8 kg*m (223.59 N*m) / 4800 rpm
Power density ------8.57
Engine type------ V type 6 cylinder DOHC24 valve

Fuel system------ EFI (electronic fuel injection)
Turbocharger -----No
Fuel type----- Unleaded premium gasoline
LEV system----- (Low emission vehicle) No
Compression ratio
Bore,------ mm 87.5
Stroke, ------mm 69.2

Fuel consumption at 10-15 modes,------ l/100km 11.2
Fuel consumption at 60 km/h,------ l/100km 5.8 mr-355-5sfte03-20-2006, 09:50 PMVZ Family
The Toyota VZ family of v6's introduced many changes for Toyota. Including various Toyota EFI, TCCU, and engine improvements from generation to generation. In general they are engines with large amounts of low-midrange horsepower, and torque well suited for various duties from car, truck, and SUV use. The blocks are all strongly made cast iron, with large main bearing cradles, and 4 bolt main bearing caps. Forged steel crankshafts are standard on all. Piston & ring construction are typical parts, with rods varying between large, and very large for stock v6 production engines.

The low angle DOHC cylinder heads were designed & mostly built by Yamaha, or by Toyota under license, and produce a large amount of low-mid torque/horsepower, without high rpm valve float.


2VZ-FE
The 2VZ-FE is a 2.5 L (2507 cc) version. Bore is 87.5 mm and stroke is 69.5 mm. Output is 158hp@5800rpm 152lb/ft@4600rpm. Used on the 88-91 Camry / ES 250, the 2vz-fe is the easiest of the Toyota v6's to turbocharge, owing from the rear bank's exhaust manifold pipe crossing over to the front bank. Making normally complex turbocharger mounting & piping a simple case of mounting the turbo onto the front bank.


3VZ-E
The 3VZ-E is a 3.0 L (2958 cc) version. Bore is 87.5 mm and stroke is 82 mm. Output is 150 hp at 4800 RPM with 180 lb/ft of torque at 3600 RPM. The engine was used in the 1988-1995 4Runners.


3VZ-FE
The 3VZ-FE came to life when Toyota recognized that it needed a larger V6 engine to suit the then upcoming 3rd generation Camry platform. It's basic design incorporates an updated version of the last revision of the 3VZ-E's block, mated with the Yamaha designed/built DOHC (24 valve) FE V6 heads, and Toyota's most advanced OBD-I control system. The upper aluminum intake manifold has is a split chamber intake manifold with Toyota's ACIS varriable intake system feeding three sets of runners for both heads. Parts wise, the 3VZ-FE shares very little with previous engines, including the 3VZ-E, and 2VZ-FE. The few parts shared with the 3vz-e, that are interchangeable are the main bearings, little else is the same. In a surprising twist, no electronics from other Toyota (Denso) parts are swappable.

It is a smooth running engine that was used as the 3.0L V6 engine on the Camry platform between 1992-1997.5 DEPENDING on what part of the world you are in. North America saw the engine only in 1992-1993, while Australia & NZ had it from '92-'96, and the engine was available in some parts of Asia, and in the JDM Toyota Windom through 1997.5. The 1992-1993 engine has 185bhp @ 5800rpm, 189ft-lb @ 4600rpm. 1994+ have 200bhp @ 5800rpm, 204ft-lb @ 4600rpm. There is no mechanical difference in the engine. In an embarrassing move, Toyota inadvertently created an engine competing with the more performance oriented 7M-GE, & 1JZ-GE installed in sportier, more luxurious cars of the time. Because of this, both stock ignition timing, and fuel tuning were set more conservatively than normal capping power output.

The power spread of the 3VZ-FE is wide, having 100% torque at just 2500rpm - 4600rpm, with power trailing off by 6000rpm. Stock redline is 6850rpm, and the ECU's fuel/ignition cut is over 7000rpm. The valvetrain was designed for no float over the stock programmed operational range.

Tho harder to find in good used condition in North America (unless imported), the 3VZ-FE is a fairly common V6 in most parts of the world, after having a good lifespan in popular models. They are cheap, simple, have few problems, and have become a semi-popular subject for engine swaps.

The 3VZ-FE also started Toyota's trend of severely overbuilding their production V6's. Having a larger forged steel crankshaft, and large cast rods, they are capable of more than doubling stock power output easily. With a few nitrous, and turbocharged examples matching, or exceeding 450 horsepower on both the stock engine, and stock engine management (with a piggyback/interceptor controlling fuel/ignition).


4VZ-FE
The 4VZ-FE is a 2.5 L engine, designed to replace the 2vz-fe as Toyota's worldwide 2.5L v6.





5VZ-FE
The 5VZ-FE is a 3.4 L (3378 cc) engine. Bore is 93.5 mm and stroke is 82 mm. Output is 190 hp (142 kW) at 4800 RPM with 220 ft.lbf (298 Nm) of torque at 3600 RPM. It has an cast iron engine block and aluminum DOHC cylinder heads. It uses MFI fuel injection, has 4 valves per cylinder with bucket tappets and features large cast connecting rods, a one-piece cast camshaft, and a cast aluminum intake manifold.

The 5VZ-FE also continued the 3VZ-FE's trend of being far overbuilt for it's intended application. With a handful of built versions exceeding 900bhp, and examples of stock engines producing 450bhp+. This has become a popular engine to consider when doing engine swaps. With the avalibility of the 3.4L TRD Supercharger, and custom Turbocharger setups. Toysrme03-20-2006, 11:24 PMYa, I wrote all that. & the MZ stuff & edited the GR & UZ stuff. Some douche bag keeps changing all the stuff, saying this & that has forged steel rods. mr-355-5sfte03-20-2006, 11:51 PMnicely done toysrme.... on the original that is. I just ran across this on google, figured I should share it. feel free to correct that post.. or remove it. Weasy2k03-21-2006, 03:24 AMyea i was laughing at the crap that was there before toysrme came in mr-355-5sfte04-01-2006, 07:56 PMwell... paypal ruled in the seller's favor!! isn't that some #$%@.
so I've actually found a wiring schematic for the 4vzfe... and it looks like it's a go. so hopefully we can add this little motor to the list of possible swaps. V6'er04-01-2006, 08:14 PM1. DON'T use that engine. You'll be sorry that you did.

2. Hire an attorney in CA that will appear in Small Claims Court for you and sue the mother ****ing scumbag. Sue for attorney's fees as well.

3. If you don't believe me, call a Prepaid Legal representative and sign up for a $19/month plan. They will answer any legal questions you have and advise you on how to proceed. They have a network of attorneys, in probably all of the 50 states, and one will appear for you for FREE or CHEAP. Weasy2k04-02-2006, 04:51 PMits got a decent amount of tq and hp...i wouldnt mind using it.. mikeswickednick04-03-2006, 04:21 PMrevable! mr-355-5sfte04-03-2006, 10:36 PMv6'er: there's nothing I'd like to do more than to sue the fool for what his shotty business is worth... but unfortunately I'm still in school, work full-time, and have limited resources.. along with NO free time... I do all my research and forum-time on breaks!!
my tranny bolts up fine, and the jap wiring plans aren't much different from the US harness... just a different colored dot on the same color wire...

will anyone need the passenger axle shaft from the v6?? it has the carrier bearing intact.. Weasy2k04-04-2006, 01:25 PMyou need 280deg cams...stiffer valve springs...ported and polished head...ems and rev it to 8000rpm....mmmm mr-355-5sfte04-04-2006, 03:21 PMWeasy2k....I'll have all of my parts shipped to you ASAP... since you so kindly offered :D mr-355-5sfte04-04-2006, 03:24 PMspeaking of those ^ parts... I would think the cams for the 3vzfe are a bit different than this 4v.....along with the valve springs... any ideas.?? Gairloch04-04-2006, 08:15 PMMaybe you could let him know that you're not satisfied by his explanation and tell him that unless he makes reparations of some kind you're going to explore your legal options. Throw the threat on the table and see if you can leave it up to him to try and solve the problem. Weasy2k04-05-2006, 01:31 AMspeaking of those ^ parts... I would think the cams for the 3vzfe are a bit different than this 4v.....along with the valve springs... any ideas.??


valve springs are the same....they will handle near stock conditions with some mild power..but push them at all and they will float....

I will work on getting valve springs made for them if there is a demand...i just need to get a hold of the stock spring.

Cams...no idea until i see it! mr-355-5sfte04-09-2006, 09:10 AMwell.. it is a relief that the timing components are the same for the 3vz... I've been looking everywhere trying to find a 4vzfe timing belt\tensioner... broke down and purchased one from a 3vz to see if it MIGHT be similar.. and it's THE SAME! so now I'm looking at the oil\water pumps... the photos look the same, but I won't know until I have them side by side.
I'm hoping that toyota has pulled another "5sfe = 3sfe, just with .2L more displacement" deal ... that would mean the gasket sets will be the same, pumps.... wiring.... it might be a decent swap afterall. I'd still like to own KTAUTO2U, but that's not likely to happen.
I'll keep you guys posted of the similarities.... that is, if there are any more. Weasy2k04-09-2006, 01:58 PMall the vz blocks have same water pump

well at least the 3vz-e -fe 5vz-fe and now you say 4vz as well...

the only thing different is the timing belts and the cam pulleys mr-355-5sfte04-24-2006, 02:55 PMI have come to find out that the intake and exhaust cam gears are the same as the 3vzfe... as are the timing components... ie. belt, tensioner... I might have stated this before, but I was unsure of the displacement affecting the timing belt length... it does not on this engine. the part numbers are the same from 3vz to 4vz... I have since recieved a refund from KTAUTO2U and have been allowed to keep the engine.... AS IS of course. so I am in search of a better wiring harness than the one I already have, once that is aquired I will start my 2.5L install. Toysrme04-24-2006, 08:27 PMI've been keeping tabs on that guy to make sure he doesn't sell any more. I also just ***** slapped the entire v6 / a/t sellers list on ebay.

New rule... We're boycotting any seller that doesn't show a specific picture of the 3000 (cc) plate on the manifold, and/or the 3VZ block stamping on the even engine bank, (front side) top left hand corner.

Also, payments should be made with a Money Order from the US Post office. That way if they want to risk screwing you, they'll get hit with mail fraud, which is a federal crime.

The same for the ones selling the 88-91 A540 transmission, and 88-91 E152, as post 91 replacements. Weasy2k04-24-2006, 09:19 PMi still wouldnt mind getting one of those engines....why all the people ripping others off...? is it cheap to buy these 4vz from japan or something? Toysrme04-24-2006, 11:35 PMI don't know. One guy that did an ES owner a week ago claimed ignorance.
I'm thinking it's cost. I've been looking at it for a little while now more seirously. It seems the US engines are cleaned up a LOT more, and cost more, while the JDM ones, not so much.

As of this second on ebay, every v6 that's stripped of a lot of things is JDM, all the "more" complete engines are USDM & cost several hundred dollars more on average.

That may, or may not be an ignorant statement, but I can't really explain why some are $500usd & some are $900-1000. mr-355-5sfte04-27-2006, 05:12 AMI agree on that statement^.... I can't find a reason for the price difference either. mr-355-5sfte06-15-2006, 02:06 PMhttp://img408.imageshack.us/my.php?image=041410sb.jpg
http://img408.imageshack.us/img408/2276/041410sb.th.jpg (http://img408.imageshack.us/my.php?image=041410sb.jpg)

I think I am just going to try and find a COMPLETE 3vzfe engine harness instead of piecing together what is left of this 4vz's..... not only is it cut in multiple places, the colors are different, the gauges are different.... I think I've had enough of this headache... and on top of that, I'm moving after school .. so my last ditch effort to have this thing completed is on the july 4th holiday...... so if there is anyone out here that has a 3vzfe harness for sale.... let me know ASAP please! mr-355-5sfte@hotmail.com
thanks mr-355-5sfte06-27-2006, 09:05 AMhere's a photo of the new body... it's been reshaped, and is completely "Rhino Lined" .... it's now impervious to the elements!!!
http://img479.imageshack.us/my.php?image=p62300891mc.jpg mr-355-5sfte06-27-2006, 09:06 AMhttp://img479.imageshack.us/img479/7525/p62300891mc.th.jpg (http://img479.imageshack.us/my.php?image=p62300891mc.jpg) Weasy2k06-27-2006, 10:56 AMhahah thats pimp :) mr-355-5sfte06-27-2006, 11:14 AMhere are a few during and after the body mods..... and a few next to this massive army transporter

http://img2.freeimagehosting.net/uploads/th.e768c64d30.jpg (http://img2.freeimagehosting.net/image.php?e768c64d30.jpg)
http://img2.freeimagehosting.net/uploads/th.6fbd651a19.jpg (http://img2.freeimagehosting.net/image.php?6fbd651a19.jpg)
http://img2.freeimagehosting.net/uploads/th.e2c16a0f65.jpg (http://img2.freeimagehosting.net/image.php?e2c16a0f65.jpg)
http://img2.freeimagehosting.net/uploads/th.a249b1bada.jpg (http://img2.freeimagehosting.net/image.php?a249b1bada.jpg)
http://img2.freeimagehosting.net/uploads/th.613d5f7aea.jpg (http://img2.freeimagehosting.net/image.php?613d5f7aea.jpg)
http://img2.freeimagehosting.net/uploads/th.e072c01b2a.jpg (http://img2.freeimagehosting.net/image.php?e072c01b2a.jpg)
http://img2.freeimagehosting.net/uploads/th.607f912d23.jpg (http://img2.freeimagehosting.net/image.php?607f912d23.jpg)
http://img2.freeimagehosting.net/uploads/th.bf35b4538a.jpg (http://img2.freeimagehosting.net/image.php?bf35b4538a.jpg)
http://img2.freeimagehosting.net/uploads/th.2d33ea6f11.jpg (http://img2.freeimagehosting.net/image.php?2d33ea6f11.jpg) Weasy2k06-27-2006, 11:26 AMyou posted the pic before that text :) mr-355-5sfte06-27-2006, 11:40 AMI'm remedial. thanks for pointing it out to everyone Weasy !!! LOL Toysrme06-27-2006, 01:45 PMred X's of death Weasy2k06-27-2006, 01:50 PMi see one picture...yet in your post there is lots of links...i think you gotta fix it...i hate those online hosting services...some suck balls others just lick mr-355-5sfte06-28-2006, 09:03 AMthe odd thing is.... the red x's are still there, but I can click on them and the photos show up?!? Weasy2k06-28-2006, 08:41 PMits becuse the site has a leech thing on there to prevent the pictures from being posted but instead are links. mr-355-5sfte07-29-2006, 10:36 PMhey guys... still working on the harness!!! I've narrowed down each wire... and multiple colors... gauges.... and have come to a problem... my tranny is an auto... the v6 ecm I hav is from an auto... won't this screw up my shift pattern.. or at least the shift rpm? or will I just be able to shift it manually with the shift cables... I mean.. hell, I do it all the time with my 4cy.. you can't really DRIVE an automatic... so I manually change the gears sometimes to fool myself into thinking I have a real car. but back to the problem at hand.... do you think it's going to be a big issue? I'm also wondering about which torque converter I should use... the one designed for the 4cyl engine and tranny.... or the one designed for a 6cyl.. with my 4cyl tranny. if I go the v6 converter route, I'll need the v's flexplate... if I go the 4cyl route, I don't thinkg the converter will cause a proper shift.....
any ideas guys?
thanks in advance mr-355-5sfte08-15-2006, 02:25 PMno luck yet on the tranny options.... so how about this question:

I've aquired a fuel pump from a 1mzfe... shouldn't I be able to make it work with the 4vzfe? as long as I can get it in the factory bracket, and wired properly.... it should work without a hickup..... (correct?) aside from maybe pushing a little too much petrol.... not that much more, but the fuel return lines and regulator will take care of that..... Weasy2k08-15-2006, 03:11 PMany pump will work as long as it provides enough flow out mr-355-5sfte09-06-2006, 01:47 PMhttp://img502.imageshack.us/img502/4458/p8240075nm1.th.jpg (http://img502.imageshack.us/my.php?image=p8240075nm1.jpg) mr-355-5sfte09-06-2006, 01:52 PMhttp://img407.imageshack.us/img407/1880/p7300065ak3.th.jpg (http://img407.imageshack.us/my.php?image=p7300065ak3.jpg)
http://img326.imageshack.us/img326/9629/p8280080cc5.th.jpg (http://img326.imageshack.us/my.php?image=p8280080cc5.jpg)
http://img68.imageshack.us/img68/8892/p9030083ze3.th.jpg (http://img68.imageshack.us/my.php?image=p9030083ze3.jpg) mr-355-5sfte09-06-2006, 01:56 PMhttp://img68.imageshack.us/img68/3342/p9050104vi9.th.jpg (http://img68.imageshack.us/my.php?image=p9050104vi9.jpg)
http://img310.imageshack.us/img310/6976/p9050105hd3.th.jpg (http://img310.imageshack.us/my.php?image=p9050105hd3.jpg)
http://img455.imageshack.us/img455/8114/p9050106vu0.th.jpg (http://img455.imageshack.us/my.php?image=p9050106vu0.jpg) mr-355-5sfte09-06-2006, 01:57 PMhttp://img407.imageshack.us/img407/9537/p9050107jr8.th.jpg (http://img407.imageshack.us/my.php?image=p9050107jr8.jpg)


HERE"S THE 4VZFE CAST

http://img68.imageshack.us/img68/191/p9050108ic6.th.jpg (http://img68.imageshack.us/my.php?image=p9050108ic6.jpg) mr-355-5sfte09-06-2006, 01:59 PMand she's in !!

http://img310.imageshack.us/img310/205/p9050109rg8.th.jpg (http://img310.imageshack.us/my.php?image=p9050109rg8.jpg)

Time to see if she'll fire mr-355-5sfte09-06-2006, 02:01 PMwish me luck! 3VZ-FE09-06-2006, 05:40 PMCool. Good luck! :) mr-355-5sfte09-07-2006, 08:02 PM@#$%.... the engine fires and will rev (on its own) to about 3k... then dies. I'm thinking the fuel is cutting off immediately after I stop cranking....
anyone else have this issue?
I've checked and re-checked my wiring... everything matches.... so I'm kind of stumped and burnt-out at the minute...
please help!!! V6'er09-07-2006, 08:19 PMIf you wired the FP lead at the Diag connector, you can power the pump from the rear relay box with a jumper. See if it stays running this way. Node09-10-2006, 06:32 PMDont be bummed out, you are SO close...

I ran into the same issue. The fuel system is priming but not switching to its lower power "econno" mode. The MR2 uses a resistor pack to run lower voltage to the fuel pump at idle and light load. Just hook a new relay to the FP or circuit opening relay output on the ECU (depending on the ECU). Then hook constant 12V to the other side of the relay and hook the output to the fuel pump. The other side of the fuel pump is grounded already so you can use a multimeeter to check what wire to hook up to. They are the big blue and white wires. The small wires are the level and fuel idiot lamp. V6'er09-10-2006, 06:45 PMIf the fuel pump resistor is still there, it needs to be removed and bypassed. No additional relays are required. Node09-10-2006, 07:02 PMI figured the majority of the stock harness was removed... its just something I ran into a couple of times. V6'er09-10-2006, 07:55 PMI figured the majority of the stock harness was removed... its just something I ran into a couple of times.


Good point. It *should* be gone with the new harness, but it might not be. mr-355-5sfte09-12-2006, 04:24 PMit fires... and runs... I didn't do anything to the relays.... or the pump itself. I just kept cranking it and decided to run. I have another problem though!! I have an extra VSV sensor that isn't hooked to anything (harness-wise) and I know where it is supposed to go (vacuum-wise)... it hooks to the fuel pressure-up vsv... I think... anyone have an extra? V6'er09-12-2006, 09:04 PMUnless you need the EVAP system to function, don't worry about it. Toysrme09-12-2006, 10:05 PM@#$%.... the engine fires and will rev (on its own) to about 3k... then dies. I'm thinking the fuel is cutting off immediately after I stop cranking....
anyone else have this issue?
I've checked and re-checked my wiring... everything matches.... so I'm kind of stumped and burnt-out at the minute...
please help!!!

it fires... and runs... I didn't do anything to the relays.... or the pump itself. I just kept cranking it and decided to run. I have another problem though!! I have an extra VSV sensor that isn't hooked to anything (harness-wise) and I know where it is supposed to go (vacuum-wise)... it hooks to the fuel pressure-up vsv... I think... anyone have an extra?
You could just be running off the cold-start injector too. I'm not sure how the mr2 fuel pump activates, but on the 3vz-fe, the genII denso AFM has an internal relay so that when the vacuum sucks the door, it trips the fuel pump on. mr-355-5sfte09-12-2006, 10:23 PMthere is NO cold start injector on this 4vz... there also is not any evap components..... she's not legal. but she sounds SO good! I removed most of the 5sfe's harness... the only remnants is the #2 relay box (houses the 4cyl relays at the rear driver side of the engine bay)
so.. now what about removing the "fuel resistor"

I made sure that the AFM was sending its signal to the ecm to power the relays....so that's not realy a problem. anymore... I am fabing up some intake piping that will house fittings for the PCV from the bank nearest the passenger compartment.... and also the fitting for the IACV ... my iacv seems to be cracked around the little plastic base... do you think a little "glue" will keep it functioning for now?

I also need to know where the smaller vacuum fitting from the IACV goes.... it is the one pointing towards the passenger side of the car.... I know the larger hose goes to the intake after the filter and prior to the AFM...

thanks again for all the help guys... mr-355-5sfte09-12-2006, 10:25 PMalso... where is the rear banks pcv hose routed to? Weasy2k09-12-2006, 11:57 PMIts a vent...:) the atmosphere V6'er09-13-2006, 05:07 PMAh, didn't know you started with a 5SFE. There's no fuel pump resistor with that engine. mr-355-5sfte09-14-2006, 09:03 AMyeah... the 'ol 5sfe trick huh? ... should be a noticeable difference in power right? I found that the rear banks pcv doesn't vent to the atmosphere.. it plugs into the bottom side of the 4vz's intake... making the car idle much better.

I was about to take her off the jackstands last night, but I ran it out of gas testing and routing vacuum lines. so T minus 5 hrs. and counting until I destroy the tranny!!:D mr-355-5sfte09-14-2006, 03:58 PMwell.. the 5sfe was MUCH faster then this 4vz... simply because I aparently have some tranny issues. my transmission won't recognise any position other than P R N D... when I put it in L... it acts as if it is in Drive... when I put it in 2 it acts like Nuetral.... and Drive has no power what so ever. the enging is running rough when I lightly accelerate, but is fine when I stand on it?? but when I stand on it... there's NO power..?!?!?
any ideas guys? Node09-14-2006, 11:34 PMYou put the wrong transmission in.... LOL but seriously You may have both a missadjusted selector cable and throttle cable. mr-355-5sfte09-15-2006, 08:58 AMwrong tranny?? nah... I used my A241E... so maybe....


but I've adjusted my "kickdown" cable from both ends of the spectrum... and there's no difference.... you think there might be some issues with the V6 computer controlling the 4cyl tranny? if so... ya think I can run the 5sfe's ecu only ont he tranny.... but wire it to think that it is controlling everything else also?? Node09-15-2006, 09:01 AMThere should not be a difference in the transmission control. TheV6 ECU should run it. The transmission should work in "safe mode" if you unplug it from the computer. Have you gone through the BGB transmission diagnosis? mr-355-5sfte09-15-2006, 03:37 PMyeah I went through the complete trouble shooting list... and the only thing I can think of next would be the torque converter.... I used the V6 converter from an es300's 3vzfe (new) would that make the difference?? should I have used the TC from the 5sfe instead??? I won't be working on this thing all weekend... I'm hitching a ride to NOPI with my supra friends... so I'll put full coverage on my douce and whoever wants a 4vzfe... can come "pick one up".... and the car!!! Toysrme09-15-2006, 04:02 PMhttp://img.photobucket.com/albums/v414/Toysrme/Answers/IAC2.jpg
Red intake
Pink low speed power steering vacuum source
Blue's throttlebody / EGR cooler coolant
Green air-assist for fuel injectors
I think that's right, its been a real long time since I had a look at that picture. You'll obviously wanna cap the powersteering vacuum. (The main P/S source is on the ACIS side. Cap that too.)
Get an A241E FSM & look at the transmission shift control sheet/logic. Best I can tell you is compair that to the FSM from a 3vz-fe or 94 1mz-fe. mr-355-5sfte09-19-2006, 07:09 PMI appreciate that photo Toysrme... I got to wondering if the fact that I'm still running the 4cyl's instrument cluster is messing with the tranny's shift patter... I can't remember any wires that go from the tach to the tranny... only from the ecm (NSW and tranny solenoids) but when I put the transmission into 2nd... it acts as neutral until 9k on the tach... then it decides to hook up???? wtf! I KNOW how to fix this... just do the manual tranny swap!!! but finding the parts is a PITA! mr-355-5sfte09-22-2006, 07:53 AMI had to drive this houpty to school on tuesday, and on the way home... she started melting stuff!! so I've replace some wires\relays\fuses\sensors... and it's running again, but I'm throwing codes like no ones business!! both knock sensors, coolant temp, ECT, 02, maf..... they just keep coming:omg:
so I'll get on those and let you guys know what happens. mr-355-5sfte09-24-2006, 08:59 PMboth knock sensors are still throwing codes!!? I guess mine might be bad from the boat ride over?? so I've got a few from my 5sfe and 5sfte in the garage (same part #'s) so I'll swap them out soon and see if they'll make the difference. mr-355-5sfte09-25-2006, 08:58 AMwith both knock sensors set off, wouldn't that put the engine into a sort of "limp mode" ... shutting off power\torque.... is there a way to bypass the knock sensors? mr-355-5sfte09-27-2006, 05:54 PMhavn't had time to swap the knock sensors yet... but I was messing with the tranny a bit and found that it actually runs better with the "kickdown cable" unhooked!? I have better throttle response, but the transmission still shifts WAY to early, and doesn't alow me to "manually" shift gears (L- acts like first gear for a split second, then shifts to 2nd) (2- acts the same as L does??) and "Drive" does all of the above, but quicker! so there's absolutely no "dropping of gears" when I floor it in drive on the interstate.... it just gradually pick up speed...while getting about 10mpg. and AND.... it's blowing ALOt of carbon out! never thought I'd say it but, I miss my 5sfe!!!

oh and Jim, I disconected the tranny from the computer to try and enter the "safe mode" you spoke of, but then it wouldn't start... this is because I of the neutral start switch isn't it? mr-355-5sfte09-29-2006, 11:36 AMI've been looking over the ecm wiring diagrams lately, and found that my Engine coolant temperature sending unit is not wired to anything!!? but my temperature sensor IS, and my gauge is registering about 1\4 of the normal operating temp.... what I need to know is: where will my coolant temp sending unit wire into??? I've been looking at these harness diagrams, and can't seem to see where it goes!? I think this might be the reason my tranny is not shifting right \ why the engine is over fueling constantly \ and why my coolant gauge is not fully "warm" .... the tranny won't shift over 3k rpm when the engine is "cold" ... so I'm hoping this has someting to do with my situation.

also, with me not running any air conditioning components... will I have any use for the A/C amplifier or ACT wires coming from the 3vz's ecm? V6'er09-29-2006, 06:31 PMEven though you aren't using A/C, the radiator fans are controlled by the A/C Amplifier, so you surely don't want to remove it. You CAN, but why make more work for yourself?

The gauge and the ECU have different sensors, so just because one is not working correctly doesn't mean the other isn't. mr-355-5sfte09-30-2006, 03:26 PMmy CEL is showing the following codes: ECT \ knk1 \ knk2
the engine coolant tempereature sensor and both knock sensors... WHY (other than detonation) would my knock sensors be throwing codes? and I've yet to see where the coolant temp sender goes in my diagrams.

thanks for the help V6'er09-30-2006, 04:48 PMECT?

Engine Coolant Temperature,

OR,

Electronically Controlled Transmission? tilma80009-30-2006, 06:37 PMOn the 3sgte the knock sensor code (52) stands for a broken knock sensor or broken wiring. It has nothing to do with detecting to much knock.

I don't know if the same applies here. mr-355-5sfte09-30-2006, 08:52 PMI can't remember off hand (at work) but I believe she was throwing codes 52 or 53... and 55 (both knock sensors) and the ECT was for the engine coolant temp. I've got replacement knock sensors, but I'm wondering if my wiring is the issue here:mad: I had to "re-wire" both knock sensors from the 4vzfe's harness because the KNK's wiring was cut... you guys think there might be some faulty wires?? I guess I'll check the resistance prior to swapping the sensors....

does anyone know EXACTLY which knock sensor is which?? ie.. is the left bank knock sensor #1 or #2??? V6'er09-30-2006, 08:58 PMDid you use shielded cable? I'll bet the stockers use shielded cable, and you just might have a noise issue. Or, you might have the polarity reversed. Since they are piezoelectric devices, they do have a plus and minus terminal, but I'm not sure it should matter here. mr-355-5sfte10-01-2006, 01:07 PMthey are shielded.... or at least they were. the wiring was cut, so I tried to repair the shielding as best as I could... I believe I connected the shielded portion to e2 on the ecm (sensor ground) but instead of soldering the actual knock sensors' wires together (since I didn't know which one was #1 or #2) I used some "quick connects" to complete the circuit... just incase they were reversed, I could quickly swap them around.... but that hasn't seemed to have any effect (switching them around)...
so it looks like I'll be messing with it again after school on monday... (still at work) mr-355-5sfte10-02-2006, 09:02 AMcodes 52 and 55 are for " no knock sensor signals to the ECM for 2 crank revolutions between 1600 rpm and 5200rpm" ... so aparently, mine aren't sending signals..... so either they're bad, or the wiring is the issue. Node10-02-2006, 09:08 AMBoth sensors bad? I seriously doubt that unless you were running the engine without headers for an extended period of time. I say wireing. mr-355-5sfte10-02-2006, 07:27 PMnode, I checked the knock sensors' circuits for resistance (fsm calls for 1 ohm or higher) they checked out fine....

then I checked both knock sensors for resistance (once again, fsm calls for 1 ohm or higher) both sensors checked out good.... SO i didn't swap out the sensors... since they were "good" I mean, they showed the EXACT same resistance as my other ones that I KNOW are good....

then I checked for an open in the harness between the knock sensors and the ECM... I was a little worried when I did this test, cause when I put the dvom on continuity... there was NO beep!! but the I wiggled the ecm plug around a bit... and there it was... the beep! so the harness is good, and was wired correctly the first time :D (I went crazy building that harness :furious: :banghead: )

so next, I pulled the EFI fuse in junction box #2... waited... waited.... jumped terminals TE1 to the other one (can't remember off hand) on the check connector... got in the car, read the codes out... the coolant temp was still being set off, so I went back over the wiring schematics... and found that I had it wired correctly the first time before I started screwing witht he guages!! so I switched it back and the code was gone!!! AND SO ARE BOTH KNOCK SENSOR CODES:D

but then I remembered that the knock sensor codes will only be thrown if it's not sending the ecm a signal after 2 or so crank revolutions at 1600 rmp or higher... so I've assembled most of the engine in hopes that I can start her up tomorrow and not get the CEL with my literally "retarded knock sensors" !!


Thanks again for all of your help guys:thumbup:

oh and the right bank's knock sensor is KNK #1 and the left is KNK #2 ... just so you know if you didn't already..... V6'er10-02-2006, 08:06 PMOh yeah. I meant to tell you that you can very often ignore most other codes until you fix the temp sensor code.

On a Turbo with a broken temp sensor, it will throw all kinds of boost codes and other crazy codes that are meaningless. mr-355-5sfte10-02-2006, 09:23 PMyeah.. that's odd. I was reading that if the temp sensor is bad, or the code is thrown, the computer will send the car into "safe mode" and won't allow the engine coolant to reach someting like 70*C... ... seems like it affects everything.
but we'll see if my problems persist tomorrow. mr-355-5sfte10-03-2006, 05:49 PMwell... the knock sensor codes are gone ...but it's now throwing codes 31 and 41.... the AFM and the TPS!? why? I don't know yet. the car still has no power, and the tranny is still not shifting correctly ( I would've thought that the knock codes would cause that... but apparently not) so I've got more reading to do.. I'll keep you guys posted. mr-355-5sfte10-05-2006, 09:05 AMcode 31 (maf) is only thrown when the engine drops below 1500rpm.... ?? I know it says it will do that in the fsm.. but WHY? that doesn't make sense that a CEL will come on if your engine drops below 1500...
and the code 41 for the TPS is saying there is either a short in the harness\sensor... or the ecm is bad. so I've checked everything and so far, everything is in working order.... but I'm still getting horrible mileage, and it's smoking like a coal burner!!:confused: mr-355-5sfte10-05-2006, 12:03 PMwell... I found a short in the harness before the tps and afm... so I corrected that and they are registering now... but guess who's back... oh yes... the knock sensor codes!!! 52 and 55... so they aparently aren't sending any signals to the computer AGAIN!? I'll tear her down again tonight and see what the hell's going on. mr-355-5sfte10-06-2006, 07:07 PMwell... there's still nothing wrong with my knock sensors... they checked out fine AGAIN !! but the codes 52 and 55 are still returning?? I've done continuity tests from each end of the circuit, and there is a connection... but the computer aparently is not getting it... maybe my ecm is bad? that's the only other possibility as stated by everything I've read.... any ideas?

also, what angle of ignition should I run the engine at? I know the fsm calls for 10* but I was messing with the distributor just a few minutes ago, took her out for a spin... and couldn't believe the power it had!! but it was smoking like Bond's car!? it was a white'ish blue color... I know that since I drove it around a bit with it over-fueling, the oil smells like strait petrol!! so is it possible that the oil is way too thin, and seeping by under load??
I'm going to change the oil saturday afternoon... hopefully that will help. V6'er10-06-2006, 07:20 PMHave you got a DVM that can read frequency? If so, you can measure the signal from the knock sensors.

You can still measure the sensors on a good DVM. Use the AC scale and see if you can get any readings. Don't disconnect anything at the ECU, just "backprobe" the connector and start the engine. You really should get *something*. mr-355-5sfte10-06-2006, 07:32 PMthat's the thing... I know the computer has to be getting some sort of signal... but it's just irritating
I'll give it a shot in the morning and let you know what the dvom is reading.
thanks v6'er mr-355-5sfte10-19-2006, 08:50 PMwell... the douce made it from nashville to new orleans and back in record time last weekend!! with both knock sensors STILL throwing codes!! so what I did when I got home (a little late on the repairs huh??) I created a completely seperate knock sensor circuit and placed the sensors in the trunk wrapped in foam (NO vibrations what so ever!) I started the engine.... and of course.... both sensors are still being thrown... codes 53 and 55.... which states "the ecm is not recieving a signal from the sensors" .... or "bad ecm" so now I'm starting to think... maybe I should find another ecm and give it a shot! because I DID get this one from pull-a-part....so...

but the good news.... IT MADE IT 8 HOURS TO NEW ORLEANS.. AND 6 1\2 HOURS BACK!! yes... same distances:devil: Node10-19-2006, 09:14 PMNICE!!

Did you ground the sensors to something? They use a case ground if I remember correctly. V6'er10-20-2006, 07:51 PMThe case ground is likely mostly for shielding. mr-355-5sfte10-22-2006, 01:23 PMmy car runs like a champ right before the ecm throws the knk codes.... and I've finally realized this only happens once the engine reaches a certain temperature... same time, same temp, same codes....

I opened my 5sfe computer today just for the hell of it... and found that my #2 injector circuit was a bit burnt... and this was my likely cause for the v-6 swap.... that and the awesome-ness! so I think I'm going to open up the es300's computer soon and see if anything is crispy.:shocked: mr-355-5sfte11-26-2006, 10:55 PMFINALLY got around to checking inside the ecm... and there's noting out of place or crispy inside... so I drove my "retarded" car to Atlanta, GA this afternoon in search of a camry\lexus ecm... I found one... drove my "retarded" car home (already 2 hrs late for work) and installed the new ecm. pulled the EFI 15 amp fuse. and pulled the efi relay for the hell of it. waited a minute or so then reinstalled everything. started the car up and BAM.... still retarded. WHYYYYYYYY?????????? still showing there is no signal from the knock sensors to the ecm. I am going WACKKKO Node11-27-2006, 12:01 PMThis is going to sound silly but how many wires do you have going into the ECM from the knock sensors? The plug on most V6ers is a very strange trianglar 3 wire. You should have two signal wires and a signal ground. mr-355-5sfte11-29-2006, 03:14 AMnode, I only have 2 wires!? one per knock sensor... the ground wire is the shielding wire that surrounds the two "power" wires... it's connected to E2 I believe. but that's it, it doesn't go anywhere other than around my two knk wires. and my plug is an odd oval shape.... please explain more
I'm running a 4vzfe with a 3vzfe's harness from a conglomeration of '93 es300's\camrys harnesses.... Powered by vBulletin® Version 4.2.5 Copyright © 2026 vBulletin Solutions Inc. All rights reserved.